With all the things couples can argue about in a marriage, MSU and I seem to have just one major issue: sex. In all honesty, the only reason it's an issue for me is because it's an issue for HIM.
Sex: it's a good thing. It's a gift to us, for sure. But I just can't get into the mindset that it's the end-all be-all reason and motivator for human existence. Sex is a TOOL for human existence. The fact that it's rather enjoyable is just a fringe benefit. So I don't attach a whole lot of importance to it. I just don't. If I get some, great. If not, oh well. And I think it's been mentioned before that MSU and I are on TOTALLY different wavelengths when it comes to sex. I've never had mindblowing sex in my marriage. And that's okay.
MSU, however, attaches a boat-load of emotional well-being to sex. His worth as a man is dependent on how much sex he's getting. His only concept of "intimacy" is through sex. He places a great deal of his self-esteem on whether or not I am "satisfied." It is apparent from our very long-term relationship that MSU's very definition of marriage is "sex when I want it, on my terms, you'd better cum or I'll pout, and see ya later I gotta go to work and you really need to clean up this house and I'm out of clean t-shirts." The point is, he needs sex to feel alive. So I accomodate his needs, which far exceed mine, because I understand that about him and want him to feel like a "whole man."
So, the same discussion arises again over the weekend. The Discussion has had several makeovers (this is from MSU casting about trying to find the magic word that's going to make me be a totally different person). My side of The Discussion is always the same: if you want "intimacy," then be intimate. Intimacy is caring about the same things that I do and applying passion toward them. Intimacy by definition does NOT mean "enjoy MSU's fumbling approach to all things sexual." Intimacy does NOT mean "come home from work, sit in front of the computer and/or TV, wait for your wife to cook dinner, do homework with the kids, get kid stuff ready for the next day, put in a load of laundry, clean up the kitchen, and then fall exhausted into bed so you can traipse into the bedroom about an hour later (after you've finally gotten off the computer after 6 hours) and wake her up to 'be close to you.'"
This time, The Discussion revolved around how important it is to MSU that I cum. In fact, it's so important to him that he threatened me - again - with dissolution of the marriage if I don't fix it. Because this is, evidently, MY problem. Let it be known that I am taking Wellbutrin, which is notorious for impairing women's ability to achieve orgasm. And I must be really special, because I CAN do it, it just takes a while and some effort - and time for that is generally limited, even when I'm alone. But MSU is convinced that I am "not making love to him" if I don't have an orgasm. Doesn't matter if he ignores me all night before coming to bed to wake me up for sex. Doesn't matter if the timing is right for me. Doesn't matter if he has NEVER paid attention to the things that turn me on, even after detailed instructions. Doesn't matter that my mind has to engage before my body does. Doesn't matter if I'm on medication for FUCKING DEPRESSION that physiologically impairs my ability to do what he wants. Doesn't matter that he wants something from me that he himself is not willing to give. His sentiment is this: if I don't start enjoying sex (he means having an orgasm), then he's outta here.
I asked him if it's ever occurred to him that I might be enjoying sex even if I don't cum? He said (and I quote), "That's impossible."
Me: So we have a problem. The problem appears to be that I'm not having orgasms and you don't like that.
MSU: Right. It's really important to me.
Me: But it's NOT really important to me. I could care less if I cum. Sex is still a nice thing even if I don't.
MSU: But you're not having fun if you don't cum.
Me: Says who?
MSU: Says me.
Me: But wouldn't I be the one to know whether or not I'm having fun?
MSU: Even if you are, you're not having orgasms, so I'll never believe that you are.
Me: Okay. But you do understand that there really isn't anything I can do about that, right? I mean, it's not like I have some "orgasm on/off button," right?
MSU: You could if you wanted to.
Me: So, let me get this straight... this is MY problem, not OUR problem. Is that what you're saying?
MSU: No, that's not what I'm saying. I'm saying that it's really important to me and I need you to figure out what I can do to help you.
Me: Well, for one thing, you can stop believing that me not having an orgasm has ANYTHING WHATSOEVER to do with YOU. You can also stop believing that my orgasms somehow dictate the quality of our sexual relations.
MSU: I can't live like this.
Me: Okay. Do you have any ideas how this can be solved?
MSU: No. I just want you to know it's an issue.
As ludicrous as this conversation was, he's serious. And honest to God, I have NO IDEA what to do.
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7 comments:
I hope you don't take offense to this because you must love him and all, but the MSU is an idiot. (about this situation anyway)
How can a man, living in this day and time still think this way? With all the information out there about men and women and sex can he still feel that a man and woman have the same needs?
The sad thing is, I get where he's coming from. I don't buy into it but I get it. For most men, cumming is sex. It's the appetizer, the main course and the dessert all wrapped up into one.
For a woman, from what I've figured out, cumming is just the dessert. The meal can be very satisfying without it.
What I can't get, at all, is if you're telling him you're satisfied and you're making an attempt to accommodate him, what the hell's the problem?
This is totally ridiculous and quite frankly it pisses me off. It's men like him that keep ALL men looking like neanderthals.
I don't know what to tell you to do. You can't reason with insanity. Maybe demand something equally ridiculous from him. Something like he has to look like Tom Selleck and be able to orgasm 5 times a night to satisfy you.
As for not helping with house work, cooking and the kids AND not being sympathetic to your depression... well that pisses me off in a whole new direction but I doubt there's enough space in this little box for me to express my feelings on that subject. It sounds like the MSU would feel more like a man if he would man-up to somemore responsibility. That can stroke an ego as well. GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR!
(((Daughter)))
That's part of why I'm so frustrated, RT. I get where he's coming from too. I understand these things about him... I just can't fathom why he refuses to understand the SAME things about me?
To his credit, MSU's first wife is a psychopath, so they always had (from his descriptions) "incredible" sex. Nothing ever came between them as far as sexual relations went. He doesn't understand that the entire reason she was able to do that is because she's a PSYCHOPATH and sees people as OBJECTS OF HER WHIM. Because *I* don't, he's gotten it into his head that she was the "normal one" and *I* am the one who's fucked up.
Go figure.
ANd I'm with you - if I'm sayign that it's okay and that my needs are being met... AND I'm doing my best to accomodate his needs as well (except for that elusive little orgasm), then what the hell is the problem?
I DON'T GET IT.
Um but I was serious about part of it.
:-P
I should do a post about the different kinds of men I see in the world.
MSU seems to be what I call a 'locker room man'. These guys are very comfortable around like minded men. They seem to feel the need to PROVE how macho they are by bragging about their manly abilities. In my opinion a locker room man would feel inadequate if he couldn't make a women orgasm. Mainly because all the other locker room males he's hanging around with are bragging about what they can do. Probably because their partners fake it from time to time, who knows.
A total guess on my part about the MSU but I've seen a lot of this stuff in my life, being a male and all.
Jen: B... B... be serious about B :D
Its difficult to explain to some men but I don't need to cum to have fantastic sex. I've only ever cum twice in my life :)
The second time wasn't even orgasmic - but sex with my ex was pretty amazing everytime.
We talked about this a couple of times, he did believe me I guess it must have been obvious I was enjoying it. For him and I guess a lot of men, cumming is the finale and the best part - so he might not have been able to understand how me NOT cumming still meant I was enjoying it.
Why don't you just fake it ;)
RT, I have to thank you for the "meal" concept... I explained it to MSU that way and he sort of, kind of, maybe got it.
We had another version of The DIscussion this morning, but this time it seemed much more productive.
I have all of you to thank for the new perspectives you offer, because it's been helpful in these situations more times than I can count. I am blessed to have you all and don't think that I am not grateful every day.
TT: Exactly! :-)
But we gotta work on that "twice in your life" thing. :-)
*blush*
Analogies and logic are all I have... and I do mean, that's all I have. :) I'm happy to hear it may have helped. At least he's listening anyway.
You're grateful? You don't think I'm grateful? I'm sitting in the middle of a conversation, listening to three fantastic women, talking about cumming and orgasms and nobody seems to mind.:D gold, pure gold I'm tellin' you! lol
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